I fully expect Google to comply. Thankfully, the only service of theirs that I use is Youtube.
If a civil war happens, I think a side effect is that Google’s domination over video platforms would be over. People would end up flocking towards the ones that aren’t in service to the Regime.
Choosing to be on YouTube for money is so stupid. They have no contract.
Most people are not choosing to be on youtube for money. They are on youtube to make videos, because they enjoy making videos. However, they need money to survive. If I like their content, and want them to make more content, then they need money. Otherwise they have to spend less time making videos and more time making money by some other contractual means.
The only way to get them to move on is not supporting them, on YouTube.
You believe people making videos on youtube should move on and do, idk, real work or something? However, if that person has an audience that enjoys watching their videos, they very clearly want them to keep making videos. Them “moving on” would be the exact opposite of what they want.
If you’re under the impression that they could move to a non Google owned video streaming platform, there is no real option. People could make their own websites for their own videos, but viewers are not going to go to a hundred different websites. Not everyone’s content fits Nebula’s platform. There is no platform that can host videos in the same way YouTube can. Maybe one day peer tube will be good enough that we can realistically use that to spread the load of video hosting, but we are not there yet.
To suggest that YouTubers need to move on is truly wild. Especially given Nebula is made up of YouTubers.
Otherwise they have to spend less time making videos and more time making money by some other contractual means.
You saying youtube is the only way to make money? Even competition on youtube means its unlikely you will make money, I get its tough out there.
Look, if you are watching youtube, you are supporting youtube first. That is a fact, it is inescapable.
but we are not there yet.
There are not alternatives, because people are still supporting youtube. There are options. People aren’t going to go to websites anymore? Ok, oh well, its dead. Sorry.
The worst part and you glossed over this: they have no contract. Unless you are very top of your game (like the top 5%), even if they have a semblance of one, it favors youtube. Their livelihood could be gone in a day if youtube decides to drop them, or reduce their pay, or even promote someone else. It is a bad business plan. Youtube even retains the rights to continue to make money from you, even after you are kicked out. They even can backcharge you, its in the terms.
Especially given Nebula is made up of YouTubers.
I am aware, I am putting money to support a place for them to go. To also quit playing the ad game. The two I watch on Nebula are Nebula only, but the growth of the patform won’t happen without support so here we are.
At the end of the day: Why the hell do we care so much about passive activities like watching people? I got rid of my TV back in the day for years, and frankly I think I might just get rid of all video consumption in the near future. I would rather be doing to watching.
Literally in my comment that you quoted, I said there are other ways to make money. I said “making money by some other contractual means.” meaning non-youtube related methods for making money.
Look, if you are watching youtube, you are supporting youtube first. That is a fact, it is inescapable.
This whole reply chain is about using non-youtube clients. Literally not supporting youtube, or the creator as a consequence. If you use a non-youtube client and pay the creator director, you bypass supporting youtube in a monetary fashion at all.
There are not alternatives, because people are still supporting youtube. There are options. People aren’t going to go to websites anymore? Ok, oh well, its dead. Sorry.
This is just a lack of understanding on the scope of the requirements for video hosting on the scale of YouTube. To let anyone upload as much as they want whenever they want entirely for free? There are soooo many reasons why there are no other real options. It is cost. Virtually no other company has the capability to do what YouTube is doing. With how successful YouTube is, if it were even remotely possible, plenty of people would be doing it. The only other company that might have the ability to compete would be Amazon, but it literally would not be profitable for a long time, and that doesn’t solve anything for this conversation since Amazon is no different from Google.
The closest we get is platforms like Nebula, but that is very different. That is for established creators to be able to post either more in depth content, or exclusive content for a more reliable revenue source. Without YouTube (or a YouTube alternative), how would one become established enough to be able to join Nebula in the first place?
The worst part and you glossed over this: they have no contract. Their livelihood could be gone in a day if youtube decides to drop them, or reduce their pay, or even promote someone else. It is a bad business plan.
I didn’t directly mention it, but I did say they could make money in some other contractual means. That still applies if they lose their job overnight with youtube. But also, Nebula could stop get enough subscribers to be able to afford their creators and go under, virtually losing that revenue source overnight.
What gets me is you act like other jobs are way better, when there are literally massive layoffs happening in the US right now.
“Their livelihood could be gone in a day if Amazon decides to lay them off, or reduce their pay, or even hire someone else.” is also just as true.
At the end of the day: Why the hell do we care so much about passive activities like watching people?
Ignoring the conversation on the value of entertainment, Youtube is more than just entertainment. It is an incredibly large source of knowledge. Watching people is how so many things are learned. I am talking in person teaching, mentorship, training, lectures, conferences, presentations, and even videos. If you want to do something you’ve never done before, it would be done best by watching someone else do it first, and then attempting it yourself. When you attempted it, you may have missed some things, so you can rewatch to reinforce what you missed. This applies to videos and non-videos. It would be far less efficient to skip the watching/learning, and go straight into the doing. It would take longer to figure out and achieve a comprehensive understanding. Could it be done? Sure, eventually. But there is literally a famous quote for that:
“Only a fool learns from his own mistakes. The wise man learns from the mistakes of others.”
― Otto von Bismarck
Watching is the slowest way of learning though, particularly on youtube because they are trying to stretch eveything out.
Sorry I edited after you were beginning a response, but the contractual part is really a huge sticking point: the youtuber can be booted at any time, including forcing them to give back money AND youtube can keep showing their videos for revenue. It is predatory.
Using a third party client is still supporting youtube, because it keeps the belief they must be on youtube going. Also, if you are using a third part client, you are pretty much negating the notion that you are supporting the video maker (I hate the terms content and creator, yuck.)
What gets me is you act like other jobs are way better
At least you have an agreement, some basic work protections and can set your terms. But that is a completely different discussion. If anything youtube helps enable this problem, it simply transfers money up and pushes propaganda to keep doing it.
This is just a lack of understanding on the scope of the requirements for video hosting on the scale of YouTube.
No I understand it completely. I say take ownership and do it yourself. I can share videos from my web site (that I made) to thousands without any extra cost to me. You will say but they wont find you on a website. Ok well then we are screwed, because the idea that I am going to use my work to support youtube is not an option, they are not getting my work.
What fools we’ve been, thinking we could televise the revolution on a corporate monopolist video platform, where ultimately they have absolute control over. Even bigger fools we’ve been, pinning our emancipatory power hopes to our labour?
It doesn’t seem to be as well known, but YouTube is one of the biggest distributors of blatant disinformation, and they have done fuck all about it. There are so many individual right wing disinformation channels that wield so much more power than they should. It’s so fuckin insidious. Seriously, go find one of the alt-right YouTube accounts, and just look at the comments. Not a single one will be negative. They literally police their comments, and the only thing left is sycophantic bullshit like “thank you for exposing the truth!” It’s actually disgusting. Every YouTuber can essentially build their very own echo chamber, and they do.
I know YouTube comments should generally be ignored, but when you see something that is intentionally, blatantly misleading, a single sentence comment could be all that is required to pierce the veil. It’s axiomatic at this point that their bullshit doesn’t stand up against even surface level scrutiny.
Google could combat this with little to no effort. Put a flag next the username. Display the number of manually deleted comments. Done. But they won’t. Fuck youtube. Fuck Google. They are perfectly happy to lead the charge into fascism.
It’s not just political disinformation. Watch a few how to videos on something you know a lot about. You’ll find the same wrong information repeated over and over.
All of these ‘content creators’ are really just ‘regurgitationists’.
If you want to know how to do something wrong, watch a you tube tutorial.
They are very similar in that, even if there comments point out the obvious flaws in the information, they will never correct the record. Because they never gave a shit in the first place.
You’re not wrong, but I haven’t seen these channels actively policing their comments. They’re just pushing garbage and playing the algorithm.
These political hacks are actively malicious because logic and reasoning goes against their brand.
Plus they all stroke each other off, like praise each other really obviously to the point they should be embarrassed. They have no respect for their audiences. Like joe rogan, his guests and him fall over themselves praising each other transparently.
While I think I agree with your geneal stance, I also believe ‘no knowledge is lost’ is pure hyperbole.
Aside from many different quasi-documentaries, video essayists and slice-of-life bloggers (whose content is surely backed up on other platforms or by data hoarders) the sheer amount of tacit knowledge of small computer/electronics/hardware repairs and similar, especially in smaller channels, is in no way either ‘not knowledge’ or not ‘lost’ should the platform go up in flames tomorrow.
Before YouTube, people used to share knowledge of how to do shit with computers/electronics/everything on forums. I still go and find info on those forums more often than on YouTube. Nothing would be lost is perhaps a slight over exaggeration, but not a hyperbole. I can’t remember the last time I used YouTube for anything else but entertainment.
I fully expect Google to comply. Thankfully, the only service of theirs that I use is Youtube.
If a civil war happens, I think a side effect is that Google’s domination over video platforms would be over. People would end up flocking towards the ones that aren’t in service to the Regime.
Please don’t use official YouTube clients
Use a YouTube frontend. Don’t give them any ad revenue. Make it cost them money to service you.
But maybe directly support the creators you watch. They shouldn’t also suffer because of Google
Nah.
So sick of “creators” and “content”.
People used to make videos for fun. Choosing to be on YouTube for money is so stupid. They have no contract.
The only way to get them to move on is not supporting them, on YouTube.
I say this as a Nebula subscriber and direct payment to a few entertainers I like. But they are not on youtube.
Most people are not choosing to be on youtube for money. They are on youtube to make videos, because they enjoy making videos. However, they need money to survive. If I like their content, and want them to make more content, then they need money. Otherwise they have to spend less time making videos and more time making money by some other contractual means.
You believe people making videos on youtube should move on and do, idk, real work or something? However, if that person has an audience that enjoys watching their videos, they very clearly want them to keep making videos. Them “moving on” would be the exact opposite of what they want.
If you’re under the impression that they could move to a non Google owned video streaming platform, there is no real option. People could make their own websites for their own videos, but viewers are not going to go to a hundred different websites. Not everyone’s content fits Nebula’s platform. There is no platform that can host videos in the same way YouTube can. Maybe one day peer tube will be good enough that we can realistically use that to spread the load of video hosting, but we are not there yet.
To suggest that YouTubers need to move on is truly wild. Especially given Nebula is made up of YouTubers.
You saying youtube is the only way to make money? Even competition on youtube means its unlikely you will make money, I get its tough out there.
Look, if you are watching youtube, you are supporting youtube first. That is a fact, it is inescapable.
There are not alternatives, because people are still supporting youtube. There are options. People aren’t going to go to websites anymore? Ok, oh well, its dead. Sorry.
The worst part and you glossed over this: they have no contract. Unless you are very top of your game (like the top 5%), even if they have a semblance of one, it favors youtube. Their livelihood could be gone in a day if youtube decides to drop them, or reduce their pay, or even promote someone else. It is a bad business plan. Youtube even retains the rights to continue to make money from you, even after you are kicked out. They even can backcharge you, its in the terms.
I am aware, I am putting money to support a place for them to go. To also quit playing the ad game. The two I watch on Nebula are Nebula only, but the growth of the patform won’t happen without support so here we are.
At the end of the day: Why the hell do we care so much about passive activities like watching people? I got rid of my TV back in the day for years, and frankly I think I might just get rid of all video consumption in the near future. I would rather be doing to watching.
Literally in my comment that you quoted, I said there are other ways to make money. I said “making money by some other contractual means.” meaning non-youtube related methods for making money.
This whole reply chain is about using non-youtube clients. Literally not supporting youtube, or the creator as a consequence. If you use a non-youtube client and pay the creator director, you bypass supporting youtube in a monetary fashion at all.
This is just a lack of understanding on the scope of the requirements for video hosting on the scale of YouTube. To let anyone upload as much as they want whenever they want entirely for free? There are soooo many reasons why there are no other real options. It is cost. Virtually no other company has the capability to do what YouTube is doing. With how successful YouTube is, if it were even remotely possible, plenty of people would be doing it. The only other company that might have the ability to compete would be Amazon, but it literally would not be profitable for a long time, and that doesn’t solve anything for this conversation since Amazon is no different from Google.
The closest we get is platforms like Nebula, but that is very different. That is for established creators to be able to post either more in depth content, or exclusive content for a more reliable revenue source. Without YouTube (or a YouTube alternative), how would one become established enough to be able to join Nebula in the first place?
I didn’t directly mention it, but I did say they could make money in some other contractual means. That still applies if they lose their job overnight with youtube. But also, Nebula could stop get enough subscribers to be able to afford their creators and go under, virtually losing that revenue source overnight.
What gets me is you act like other jobs are way better, when there are literally massive layoffs happening in the US right now.
“Their livelihood could be gone in a day if Amazon decides to lay them off, or reduce their pay, or even hire someone else.” is also just as true.
Ignoring the conversation on the value of entertainment, Youtube is more than just entertainment. It is an incredibly large source of knowledge. Watching people is how so many things are learned. I am talking in person teaching, mentorship, training, lectures, conferences, presentations, and even videos. If you want to do something you’ve never done before, it would be done best by watching someone else do it first, and then attempting it yourself. When you attempted it, you may have missed some things, so you can rewatch to reinforce what you missed. This applies to videos and non-videos. It would be far less efficient to skip the watching/learning, and go straight into the doing. It would take longer to figure out and achieve a comprehensive understanding. Could it be done? Sure, eventually. But there is literally a famous quote for that:
“Only a fool learns from his own mistakes. The wise man learns from the mistakes of others.” ― Otto von Bismarck
Watching is the slowest way of learning though, particularly on youtube because they are trying to stretch eveything out.
Sorry I edited after you were beginning a response, but the contractual part is really a huge sticking point: the youtuber can be booted at any time, including forcing them to give back money AND youtube can keep showing their videos for revenue. It is predatory.
Using a third party client is still supporting youtube, because it keeps the belief they must be on youtube going. Also, if you are using a third part client, you are pretty much negating the notion that you are supporting the video maker (I hate the terms content and creator, yuck.)
At least you have an agreement, some basic work protections and can set your terms. But that is a completely different discussion. If anything youtube helps enable this problem, it simply transfers money up and pushes propaganda to keep doing it.
No I understand it completely. I say take ownership and do it yourself. I can share videos from my web site (that I made) to thousands without any extra cost to me. You will say but they wont find you on a website. Ok well then we are screwed, because the idea that I am going to use my work to support youtube is not an option, they are not getting my work.
That’s fair. I’ve been meaning to set up patreon donations to the handful of creators I still watch. Thanks for reminding me.
YouTube lose would be a blow. All the knowledge there that would be lost is massive. And nobody is going to replace it.
What fools we’ve been, thinking we could televise the revolution on a corporate monopolist video platform, where ultimately they have absolute control over. Even bigger fools we’ve been, pinning our emancipatory power hopes to our labour?
It doesn’t seem to be as well known, but YouTube is one of the biggest distributors of blatant disinformation, and they have done fuck all about it. There are so many individual right wing disinformation channels that wield so much more power than they should. It’s so fuckin insidious. Seriously, go find one of the alt-right YouTube accounts, and just look at the comments. Not a single one will be negative. They literally police their comments, and the only thing left is sycophantic bullshit like “thank you for exposing the truth!” It’s actually disgusting. Every YouTuber can essentially build their very own echo chamber, and they do.
I know YouTube comments should generally be ignored, but when you see something that is intentionally, blatantly misleading, a single sentence comment could be all that is required to pierce the veil. It’s axiomatic at this point that their bullshit doesn’t stand up against even surface level scrutiny.
Google could combat this with little to no effort. Put a flag next the username. Display the number of manually deleted comments. Done. But they won’t. Fuck youtube. Fuck Google. They are perfectly happy to lead the charge into fascism.
It’s not just political disinformation. Watch a few how to videos on something you know a lot about. You’ll find the same wrong information repeated over and over.
All of these ‘content creators’ are really just ‘regurgitationists’.
If you want to know how to do something wrong, watch a you tube tutorial.
They are very similar in that, even if there comments point out the obvious flaws in the information, they will never correct the record. Because they never gave a shit in the first place.
You’re not wrong, but I haven’t seen these channels actively policing their comments. They’re just pushing garbage and playing the algorithm.
These political hacks are actively malicious because logic and reasoning goes against their brand.
Plus they all stroke each other off, like praise each other really obviously to the point they should be embarrassed. They have no respect for their audiences. Like joe rogan, his guests and him fall over themselves praising each other transparently.
No knowledge would be lost. Books exist, other video platforms exist too. Fuck YT, fuck Google, hope they die soon.
While I think I agree with your geneal stance, I also believe ‘no knowledge is lost’ is pure hyperbole.
Aside from many different quasi-documentaries, video essayists and slice-of-life bloggers (whose content is surely backed up on other platforms or by data hoarders) the sheer amount of tacit knowledge of small computer/electronics/hardware repairs and similar, especially in smaller channels, is in no way either ‘not knowledge’ or not ‘lost’ should the platform go up in flames tomorrow.
Before YouTube, people used to share knowledge of how to do shit with computers/electronics/everything on forums. I still go and find info on those forums more often than on YouTube. Nothing would be lost is perhaps a slight over exaggeration, but not a hyperbole. I can’t remember the last time I used YouTube for anything else but entertainment.
At this point, the platform has started to morph into a shitty TikTok copy and I hate it so much…ruined a good thing they had.
Save everything you want to keep
Would it be lost? Do people upload but not keep copies? I barely look at YouTube at all anymore. I could do without it.
Also Microsoft, Apple, Meta all for collection complying with the regime. It’ll be funny if it’s what brings MySpace back.
I’m more worried about people email, search, and location history being used against them.
Relevant about the email